Hmmm

[Birdwatcher]

Specifically...

I could give a shit about conservatives and liberals. I just know every person I know in the field is terrified of what's going to happen on their end.

what are they 'terrified' about? Honestly, take a look at the conservative agenda and their tactics. FEAR is the feeling they play on, the fear that was invoked on 9/11 was used to great affect by Bush/Cheney and the party continues to use fear as the motivator in most of their arguments. This so called 'reform' would have been embraced by Republicans in the eighties, but they have swung so far right that anything proposed by a democrat just has to be socialism. They really should realize that most Americans are moderate, wanting some conservatism mixed with a social conscious.

[Riccardo]

you only see one side

dems do the exact same thing. Fear the republicans, they're going to take away this, take away that, do this, do that.... Obama has used that playbook to a t his entire administration

[Birdwatcher]

No Ric not at all

dems do the exact same thing. Fear the republicans, they're going to take away this, take away that, do this, do that.... Obama has used that playbook to a t his entire administration

I see both sides as fundamentally corrupt, mainly because they answer to the corporate lobbyists rather than the electorate. Right now I just see the right as far to wedded to an ideology that does not resonate well with the 'middle' class (and by that I mean those who are neither Left or Right inclined, like me).

I don't fear a thing either side says, look at the history of politics, it has been like this forever. I pity those who live in fear of the future, such a waste of time.

[stjoebirdsfan]

what are they 'terrified' about? Honestly, take a look at the conservative agenda and their tactics. FEAR is the feeling they play on, the fear that was invoked on 9/11 was used to great affect by Bush/Cheney and the party continues to use fear as the motivator in most of their arguments. This so called 'reform' would have been embraced by Republicans in the eighties, but they have swung so far right that anything proposed by a democrat just has to be socialism. They really should realize that most Americans are moderate, wanting some conservatism mixed with a social conscious.

Specifically, that much of the cost-cutting required by the program will be borne by the hospital employees, specifically nurses and younger doctors. Nurses (at least those in my immediate family) are already seeing staff cuts, wage freezing/reduction, and benefit trimming. Generally, the sense is that they will work more/longer (more "efficiently"?) with less resources and for less. So, whatever the program might to do rates for the consumer, they may be receiving lesser quality of care. The insurance companies will find a way to get theirs.

As for your other points, I could care less what fears either major party is trying to peddle. I dont watch MSNBC and I dont watch Fox News. I can only speak to what people I know well who are currently working in hospitals preparing to implement are saying.

I guess we wont know what the real effects will be until it has been fully implemented, but I just wouldn't get too excited about whatever California's rates are doing.

[Birdwatcher]

Thats's why I trust neither side

Specifically, that much of the cost-cutting required by the program will be borne by the hospital employees, specifically nurses and younger doctors. Nurses (at least those in my immediate family) are already seeing staff cuts, wage freezing/reduction, and benefit trimming. Generally, the sense is that they will work more/longer (more "efficiently"?) with less resources and for less. So, whatever the program might to do rates for the consumer, they may be receiving lesser quality of care. The insurance companies will find a way to get theirs.

As for your other points, I could care less what fears either major party is trying to peddle. I dont watch MSNBC and I dont watch Fox News. I can only speak to what people I know well who are currently working in hospitals preparing to implement are saying.

I guess we wont know what the real effects will be until it has been fully implemented, but I just wouldn't get too excited about whatever California's rates are doing.

What they are afraid of happening is what already has happened to a lot of workers in other industries. The Great recession just showed a lot of large employers, and health care fits the bill, that you can make more by employing less people and making them do more. Guys like Henry Ford knew where his bread was buttered, but corporate leadership today has forgotten that lesson. That is where this so called reform could hurt, but no more really than the rest of us already do. I am resigned to the fact that it is happening to all of us, and whoever we elect at this point won't do a damn thing to stop it. This health care change will help some and hurt others, just like everything out of DC in the last 200+ years.

[Loki]

No. Some guy in Forbes said that the prices came

in cheaper than expected. That it wasn't as expensive as they thought it might be.

Wow. Why would anyone be upset at good news? Oh. Right.

[Maniac]

Specifically, that much of the cost-cutting required by the program will be borne by the hospital employees, specifically nurses and younger doctors.

Which is only proper because they have been driving the out-of-control cost increases of the past twenty years without any particular increase in the quality of care. Somebody posted a great link on this from Time or Newsweek recently. There may be no more $5 aspirin but health care will still be a well paying profession.

Insurance companies that dont participate in high risk pools will have to pay in anyway by transferring money to those that do.

And when you have a back-scratching system where companies losing millions of dollars and still paying executives outrageous compensations be careful about attacking admin costs at insurance companies. I doubt they are out of line and they are certainly more regulated than the sharks on wall street. $5 for an ATM transaction? 20 percent loan rates with the prime around 0?

[T.D-Bag]

[QUOTE=Loki;1705787]in cheaper than expected. That it wasn't as expensive as they thought it might be.

they could complain about the outbreak of free market capitalism in the industry

[Riccardo]

Oops - apparently not...

http://www.forbes.com/sites/theapoth...ums-by-64-146/

[tjl88]

http://www.forbes.com/sites/theapoth...ums-by-64-146/

Wow, no wonder they didn't want to read it.