Who the f*ck signed off on this guy's clearance?

[IronEagle]

I wouldn't want to be that person(s). Oh, it was a contractor!

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-nsa-snowden-20130622,0,4608330.story

[Maniac]

Slightly OT but I'm reading a book on "Clark Rockefeller" now. Effing incredible.

A guy with balls like that could have easily been a real millionaire. I guess the sociopath stuff held him back.

[Dolomite]

He's a POS

And as bad as he is he's not as bad a Bradley Manning who should be put to death. No doubt John Waker should have been executed but he wasn't. The US is too soft on people who commit treason.

[IronEagle]

Slightly OT but I'm reading a book on "Clark Rockefeller" now. Effing incredible.

A guy with balls like that could have easily been a real millionaire. I guess the sociopath stuff held him back.

"Clark Rockefeller"? I remember that. Sounds like an interesting book.

[slag]

You could wait for the movie ... I read the author sold the rights.

[harls]

And as bad as he is he's not as bad a Bradley Manning who should be put to death. No doubt John Waker should have been executed but he wasn't. The US is too soft on people who commit treason.

Bradley Manning should never have had charges brought against him in the first place. Had he NOT spoke out he could have been tried under the Nuremberg principles.

As far as Snowden he is different then Manning. Snowden would not have been breaking the law as Manning would have had he not spoke out. That said letting the American people know that their constitutional rights are being violated by the government should be applauded not demonized.

[IronEagle]

Bradley Manning should never have had charges brought against him in the first place. Had he NOT spoke out he could have been tried under the Nuremberg principles.

As far as Snowden he is different then Manning. Snowden would not have been breaking the law as Manning would have had he not spoke out. That said letting the American people know that their constitutional rights are being violated by the government should be applauded not demonized.

IDK. Snowden seems at least as much interested in revealing details of US spying on China as he does revealing violations of his interpretation of constitutional rights. It would be interesting if there was a Chinese version of Snowden to reveal the details of spying the Chinese do on their own citizens and the US.

[harls]

IDK. Snowden seems at least as much interested in revealing details of US spying on China as he does revealing violations of his interpretation of constitutional rights. It would be interesting if there was a Chinese version of Snowden to reveal the details of spying the Chinese do on their own citizens and the US.

I know some of Snowden leaking information to other countries was on the violations and total disregard of the 4th amendment. He originally released the information to over 600 "News Outlets" in the US and every one of them refused to run it. Then he took it to other countries. Once the rest of the world was talking about it then "our" news outlets started talking about it.

I am curious to hear what else he has leaked to other countries. And more importantly I want to hear about it from the other countries that do not have a vested interest in the issue.

Did snowden commit treason? Maybe. Does our government have a reason to make everyone believe he is a traitor even if he is not? Absolutely.

[Eagle Road]

"The best way to take control over a people and control them utterly is to take a little of their freedom at a time, to erode rights by a thousand tiny and almost imperceptible reductions. In this way the people will not see those rights and freedoms being removed until past the point at which these changes cannot be reversed"




- Adolf Hitler

[harls]

"The best way to take control over a people and control them utterly is to take a little of their freedom at a time, to erode rights by a thousand tiny and almost imperceptible reductions. In this way the people will not see those rights and freedoms being removed until past the point at which these changes cannot be reversed"




- Adolf Hitler

While i do not think the us government has the same endgame of genocide.. although i could be wrong if you sub muslims for jews. But i think that the goverment as a whole is hell bent on taking our rights and selling them to the highest bidder.

[Eagle Road]

While i do not think the us government has the same endgame of genocide.. although i could be wrong if you sub muslims for jews. But i think that the goverment as a whole is hell bent on taking our rights and selling them to the highest bidder.

I'm right there with you Harls, I guess my question to those that would point a finger at someone like Snowden and yell "traitor" would be,,, where is the tipping point, should Government be allowed to run rampant and unchecked?

In the end, I hope he did it because he believed what he was witnessing was wrong, all I can say to that point is that if it were me in his shoes, I would hope I would have balls as big as his, and be as smart about going into it as he was.

In the end it is a personal decision on what YOU think is right and wrong, can you live with yourself, IF YOU DO NOTHING?

Remember, ALL of our forefathers that founded this country were labeled TRATIORS by somebody.

[slag]

I bet Adolf liked the kind of self-loathing, yet patronizing, sheep who thought like this about incremental infringements on privacy:

"When you realize your life has little to no significance in the larger scheme of things, it's liberating and leads you to actual freedom. As opposed to the mythical type of freedom propagated by the usual suspects of idiots."

[Dolomite]

Bradley Manning should never have had charges brought against him in the first place. Had he NOT spoke out he could have been tried under the Nuremberg principles.

As far as Snowden he is different then Manning. Snowden would not have been breaking the law as Manning would have had he not spoke out. That said letting the American people know that their constitutional rights are being violated by the government should be applauded not demonized.

You're a loon those principles are not applicable to him. He was a secretary who had a meltdown when his boyfriend broke up with him. He's a POS and anyone who would applaud him is a POS as well.

[IronEagle]

I'm right there with you Harls, I guess my question to those that would point a finger at someone like Snowden and yell "traitor" would be,,, where is the tipping point, should Government be allowed to run rampant and unchecked?

In the end, I hope he did it because he believed what he was witnessing was wrong, all I can say to that point is that if it were me in his shoes, I would hope I would have balls as big as his, and be as smart about going into it as he was.

In the end it is a personal decision on what YOU think is right and wrong, can you live with yourself, IF YOU DO NOTHING?

Remember, ALL of our forefathers that founded this country were labeled TRATIORS by somebody.

I'd have more respect for him if he hadn't gone running to China and started revealing details of our intelligence programs against them.

You know the Chinese are trying to spy on us as well. Maybe they even listen in to your phone calls!

[IronEagle]

Some people act like this sh*t is something new.

This is pretty interesting, from 2005...

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/02/20/politics/20submarine.html?_r=0

WASHINGTON, Feb. 19 (AP) - The submarine Jimmy Carter, which joined the Navy's fleet on Saturday, has a special capability, intelligence experts say: it is able to tap undersea cables and eavesdrop on the communications passing through them.

The Navy does not acknowledge that the submarine has this capability. "That's going to be classified in nature," said Kevin Sykes, a Navy spokesman. "You're not going to get anybody to talk to you about that."
...
The Carter, like other submarines, will also have the ability to eavesdrop on communications - what the military calls signals intelligence - passed through the airwaves, experts say. But its ability to tap undersea fiber-optic cables may be unique in the fleet.

Oh, and this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Room_641A

Room 641A is a telecommunication interception facility operated by AT&T for the U.S. National Security Agency that commenced operations in 2003 and was exposed in 2006.[1][2]

Description
A fiber optic tap

Room 641A is located in the SBC Communications building at 611 Folsom Street, San Francisco, three floors of which were occupied by AT&T before SBC purchased AT&T

As an aside, I highly recommend the book "Blind Man's Bluff" if you ever get a chance to read it.