OT: Humboldt Broncos

[RSE]

The pictures tell an interesting story.

http://nationalpost.com/news/canada/humboldt-broncos-bus-crash-what-the-photos-show-about-the-point-of-impact

Initial news stories flat out said the truck t-boned the bus. After the initial stories, whether to forstall the torch and pitchfork brigade or otherwise, the news stories stopped saying that. Looking at the pictures, it’s impossible to conclude anything other than the truck blew through the stop sign and obliterated the front third of the bus.

Notice the mature pine trees at the southeast corner which likely disguised the two vehicles from the respective other drivers until it was too late. The only trees at all on that flat prairie land. Note that six people died at that same remote intersection 20 years ago. I wonder if those pines were mature then.

[broadstreetparade]

I saw that article last night and still couldnt picture it in my head what it possibly looked like. After you explained it with the trees for reference its as pretty clear what happened.

[Eagle Road]

The pictures tell an interesting story.

http://nationalpost.com/news/canada/humboldt-broncos-bus-crash-what-the-photos-show-about-the-point-of-impact

Initial news stories flat out said the truck t-boned the bus. After the initial stories, whether to forstall the torch and pitchfork brigade or otherwise, the news stories stopped saying that. Looking at the pictures, it’s impossible to conclude anything other than the truck blew through the stop sign and obliterated the front third of the bus.

Notice the mature pine trees at the southeast corner which likely disguised the two vehicles from the respective other drivers until it was too late. The only trees at all on that flat prairie land. Note that six people died at that same remote intersection 20 years ago. I wonder if those pines were mature then.

I'm no expert Counselor, but I'm not sure I agree with the truck ran thru the bus, the front of that truck is literally unscathed, and that is an aluminum grill on that truck that looks to be intact and the front corners of those fenders fold up at the slightest hint of impact???

Something else to take note of, that is not a conventional semi truck and trailer, that is a "B-Train" configuration, I believe they can go as high as 130,000 in Canada vs our semi trucks at 80,000, huge difference between the two.

Lastly, I have to wonder ( and no not because I am in transportation) is there any way the bus center punched the truck? Reason I ask is look again at the pics, see how that trailer is not only twisted but also bent in the middle.

I hate to say it, but "if" the bus hit the semi trailer it would explain the way the trailer is twisted because it would not take a lot of force to over turn that trailer if hit near the pivot point of those two trailers where they hook together.

Knowing what that B-Train weighed moving at speed, it would most likely just stayed upright, straight ahead, be interesting to see what they come up with???

But I will add I can't really figure any other way it happened other than the truck running the intersection?

[broadstreetparade]

I'm no expert Counselor, but I'm not sure I agree with the truck ran thru the bus, the front of that truck is literally unscathed, and that is an aluminum grill on that truck that looks to be intact and the front corners of those fenders fold up at the slightest hint of impact???

Something else to take note of, that is not a conventional semi truck and trailer, that is a "B-Train" configuration, I believe they can go as high as 130,000 in Canada vs our semi trucks at 80,000, huge difference between the two.

Lastly, I have to wonder ( and no not because I am in transportation) is there any way the bus center punched the truck? Reason I ask is look again at the pics, see how that trailer is not only twisted but also bent in the middle.

I hate to say it, but "if" the bus hit the semi trailer it would explain the way the trailer is twisted because it would not take a lot of force to over turn that trailer if hit near the pivot point of those two trailers where they hook together.

Knowing what that B-Train weighed moving at speed, it would most likely just stayed upright, straight ahead, be interesting to see what they come up with???

But I will add I can't really figure any other way it happened other than the truck running the intersection?

The truck had the stop sign though.

[RSE]

I read the comments to the article later some of which are interesting.

I agree the bus could have slammed into the rear third of the semi’s trailer and pushed it west and north. However, had it hit in the intersection shouldn’t there be peat bag debris scattered more widely? Maybe the bus didn’t open up the trailer and all damage was done when it went down on its side.

However, wouldn’t a direct and catastrophic hit of the trailer across the intersection have dropped the trailer right there or somewhere forward? Instead it wound up north and west of the intersection.

Either way, the truck should not have been in the intersection.

It’s possible the truck driver pulled out seeing the bus down the road and relied on the self preservation instinct of the bus driver to slow down while he crossed. Wouldn’t be surprised to learn the truck was running late.

[KenfromCanada]

According to the CBC news report last night, this has been a trouble intersection and the trees you mentioned obstruct the view partially. The driver currently is not being charged. Tragic accident that unfortunately has happened more than once in Canadian Jr hockey.

[IronEagle]

Remember from high school physics?

Momentum = Mass * velocity

Kinetic energy = Mass * velocity^2

http://ffden-2.phys.uaf.edu/211_fall2002.web.dir/ben_townsend/TypesofCollisions.htm

I believe the accident investigators will figure out what happened there. My intuition is that given the mass of the truck it had a lot more potential to do damage than the bus.

[Drama Queen]

Judging by the faint skid marks of what I believe is the bus back wheels, if the bus hit the trailer as mentioned, the bus would have to come to a complete hault upon impact, and then spin 180+ before being entangled and brought to its final location.

Hard to fathom that, but it may indeed be the case. I believe the dark skid marks are predominately the trailers and you can almost follow the marks to the final location of the trailers.

Maybe the truck did a slow crawl to, and through, the intersection. He may have tried to gun it because he was in “no man’s land”. To fast to stop and not fast enough to get through.

[TRENT]

This is just a heartbreaking story

no matter what the details are,,,Just horrible.

[IronEagle]

no matter what the details are,,,Just horrible.

Agreed. It's terrible. Has to be devastating for the community.

[Eagle Road]

I read the comments to the article later some of which are interesting.

I agree the bus could have slammed into the rear third of the semi’s trailer and pushed it west and north. However, had it hit in the intersection shouldn’t there be peat bag debris scattered more widely? Maybe the bus didn’t open up the trailer and all damage was done when it went down on its side.

However, wouldn’t a direct and catastrophic hit of the trailer across the intersection have dropped the trailer right there or somewhere forward? Instead it wound up north and west of the intersection.

Either way, the truck should not have been in the intersection.

It’s possible the truck driver pulled out seeing the bus down the road and relied on the self preservation instinct of the bus driver to slow down while he crossed. Wouldn’t be surprised to learn the truck was running late.

I guess anything is possible, had there of been more skid marks I could almost wonder if the trucker saw the bus at the last minute (after running the sign) and locked up the trailer brakes jacknifing the rear 3rd of the trailer sideways.

That would explain the trailer twisting, also I did find some other pics that show more clearly the front of the truck with very little damage, However, I also noticed that truck had a Moose Guard on the front of it, and they will take a lot of abuse, so I guess it's entirely possible he ran straight into the bus.

Either way, I agree with everyone else, hate to see this happen to anyone, esp. a bus load of kids, terrible.

[Eagle Road]

Remember from high school physics?

Momentum = Mass * velocity

Kinetic energy = Mass * velocity^2

http://ffden-2.phys.uaf.edu/211_fall2002.web.dir/ben_townsend/TypesofCollisions.htm

I believe the accident investigators will figure out what happened there. My intuition is that given the mass of the truck it had a lot more potential to do damage than the bus.

As you said, I'm sure they will figure it out, the damage to the bus doesn't really surprise me that much though, those buses are literally fiberglass sides that are glued to an aluminum subframe, there really isn't a lot of anything of substantial material in them, remember also the motor and tranny, anything with real bulk is all at the BACK of the bus, there is nothing at the front of that chassis to sustain any type of impact.

[KenfromCanada]

Agreed. It's terrible. Has to be devastating for the community.

It's a nation wide sense of loss here. So many of us rode buses or carpooled to minor hockey games all over the place and hockey is part of the Canadian fabric. It hit home for many of us.

[Drama Queen]

I read some of the comments in the article. I do believe the Driver was going at a high rate of speed through the intersection. That rig is so heavy that it’s own speed must have helped carry the rig to it’s final location.

An ex-drivers comments were persuasive.

Lots of questions and heartaches.

With that blind spot from the trees, it should have been a 4 way stop at the least.

[Eagle Road]

Man, the more I look at it, I am going with my original theory, trucker stops at the sign, doesn't see the bus, pulls out, sees the bus and floors it, just as DQ said earlier, bus hits the trailer about a 1/3 of the way back, trucker is still flat to the floor for a split second and the bus hits it and momentum of the truck with its trailer on two wheels tipping over carries it to that point in the field and the bus with it.

Explains the no damage to the front of the truck, explains the twist bend in the trailer.

I don't think that bus ever saw the truck, look at the road, the skid marks are from the trucks trailer being pushed tipping sideways, there are no marks whatsoever from the direction the bus was coming,,,,