Phils go for the sweep today

[rothdawg]

VV is in no way destined for the bullpen. For one thing, he has all the tools to be a top of the rotation guy, except for maturity. Secondly, he doesn't have the control, nor at this point the mentality, to be able to go into a game and fix someone else's mess. Curt Schilling went through similar growing pains with the Orioles and Astros before blossoming as a Phil.

Hate to break it to you, cawkalum, but almost every successful relief pitcher started out as a starting pitcher who lacked consisten control. He’s much more likely to be a bullpen piece than the next Curt Schilling.

Edit to add: Calling him a future bullpen piece isn’t really an insult. Relief pitching is more important in this era than it ever has been in the history of the sport.

[slag]

Still too early to say anything concrete but Dominguez, after a couple of 1-2-3 innings in two blowouts, was placed in a close game today and did it again.

And Neris has had two nice save outings this series ... is Dominguez in his rear-view mirror perhaps providing him incentive to not be a useless cunt?

[phillyeagles36]

What the hell happened to that first pick outfielder the Phils got a few years ago? How is he doing? I have only had the chance to watch a few games this year

[SOS Crunchy]

I don't disagree with that, but I don't think you can compare Santana to Howard. He's also only on a 3 year deal.

[SOS Crunchy]

Yeah I mean Ruf and Rizzotti put up video game numbers in the minors also but I'm 22 and ate a fuckin lunchable for dinner last night, so I'm definitely not gonna say he's behind in the game

[SOS Crunchy]

People used to complain about how bad the eagles were at drafting, but the phillies drafting he past 3 years has been disastrous in the first round. 3 top 10 picks including #1, all toolsy OFs who appear to be B,C, Js

[The Duck]

What the hell happened to that first pick outfielder the Phils got a few years ago? How is he doing? I have only had the chance to watch a few games this year

Mickey Moniak. He'll never see the inside of CBP without a ticket. Now that you know his name, go ahead and forget it.

[Snakebitten]

Cornelius Randolph and Adam Haseley are the other two future turds. They pulled a Jeff Jackson three years in a row.

[JuTMSY4]

this is a bad argument

My only argument would be that Billy Beane would get those numbers for a lot less than $25m per. I know they have money to burn right now but you send future big ticket free agents the wrong message. Now there's a good chance we have a player like Ryan Howard (at the end of career) where we are counting how many more years are we paying him $25m. I just didn't think they needed to overspend for a declining asset and bump Hoskins to the outfield.

Bumping Hoskins to the outfield is irrelevant - He's a mediocre fielder at either position.

Having Santana gives you a professional hitter in the middle of your order. Something the organization could not have created, organically, this year (and probably next). So the Santana signing is about more than just homers and RBIs. And the results have been chasing SPs out very early in games. The money is irrelevant on this payroll or the next two years.

[slag]

Hoskins didn't look mediocre at first base when I watched him play there.

[JuTMSY4]

cawkalum

VV is in no way destined for the bullpen. For one thing, he has all the tools to be a top of the rotation guy, except for maturity. Secondly, he doesn't have the control, nor at this point the mentality, to be able to go into a game and fix someone else's mess. Curt Schilling went through similar growing pains with the Orioles and Astros before blossoming as a Phil.

Hate to break it to you, cawkalum, but almost every successful relief pitcher started out as a starting pitcher who lacked consisten control. He’s much more likely to be a bullpen piece than the next Curt Schilling.

Edit to add: Calling him a future bullpen piece isn’t really an insult. Relief pitching is more important in this era than it ever has been in the history of the sport.

What on God's green earth are you talking about?

First let's clear up one issue. Vince lacks control...of his secondary pitches. His fastball is elite, but going through an order 2-3 times, hitters start to sit on it. Easy enough. When Vince's breaking pitches are on, he's unhittable though, that's why they keep using him as a starter (besides depth).

The question turns on whether Vince can ever fully control his breaking pitches, he'll turn into a stud. If he only retains mediocre command of them, that's where, as Roth points out, he'll end up in the pen with an arsenal of maybe 3 pitches (but probably 2).

[RSE]

Makes Fultz look like Tatum.

[JuTMSY4]

You mean in 29 games?

Hoskins didn't look mediocre at first base when I watched him play there.

His defensive runs saved at 1st is 0 in those 29 starts. Santana has the same over his entire career. Santana's range is slightly higher though.

Other than that, my eyes tell me he's okay - he won't fuck up a ton (a big part of 1st).

[Snakebitten]

I would have preferred they leave Hoskins at first and open that outfielder spot for a rotation of Williams, Altherr, and Kingery (Herrera stays in center). That would give them a full year to see if the second half of last year was a fluke or not. They averaged almost one run per game more in the second half. I think they all deserved at least one full year playing full time together. This was the perfect year to do it. After this season, you make a run at the big ticket free agent(s).

[slag]

It was a small sample but he looked comfortable and actually made a few nice plays.

Maybe after watching Howard for so long anything looked good.