I think this guy who blew the whistle on the US snooping might be a Chinese agent.

[IronEagle]

Oh man.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/vide...nterview-video

[The Ref]

still less concerned about gov agencies and what they do compared to the crazy, lone individual. Also usually hard for me to swallow slippery slope arguments.

[JuTMSY4]

This is the counter to debt Hawks being asked where they were during the Bush Administration.

That being said - here they were:

http://reason.com/archives/2004/02/11/leviathans-diet

Linda Blimes, a professor of budget management at Harvard's Kennedy School, argued in a recent Washington Post op-ed, suggests that the fiscal "perfect storm" of the Reagan era has led some in the administration to believe (erroneously) that deficits don't matter. But most economists believe that deficits present real barriers to growth: One estimate suggests that government competition for scarce capital at current rates of debt accumulation would result in a reduction of about $1,800 in annual income for the average household. And, of course, money to service that debt must come out of the economy eventually.

[IronEagle]

This is the counter to debt Hawks being asked where they were during the Bush Administration.

That being said - here they were:

http://reason.com/archives/2004/02/11/leviathans-diet

Austerity sucks unless you are already rich. Actually I think it just sucks.

[nerd]

it's weird...but for some reason, i don't care about them knowing who i call and whatever.

besides my dad calling me 600 times a day...i think he's the only person i talk to on the phone.

but i would rather have the government watching who is texting whom than not anymore.

[IronEagle]

it's weird...but for some reason, i don't care about them knowing who i call and whatever.

besides my dad calling me 600 times a day...i think he's the only person i talk to on the phone.

but i would rather have the government watching who is texting whom than not anymore.

I should walk back the idea that this guy is a Chinese agent. After further review, he seems more like a smug hipster who got a secutity clearance and wants to have his 15 minutes.

[ashaman]

who the hell care who this guy works for? The important fact you can take out of all this is that the U.S. government under Obama is authorized to spy on all American citizens regardless of any suspicious activities.

Remember, Obama and the rest of the civil rights groups were up in arm when the Patriots Act allowed Bush to intercept phone calls involving foreign nationals. Now, ALL U.S. citizens phone records, emails are all recorded and become property of the U.S. goverment. If you don't see anything wrong with that, then you're just a freaking idiot.

[IronEagle]

who the hell care who this guy works for? The important fact you can take out of all this is that the U.S. government under Obama is authorized to spy on all American citizens regardless of any suspicious activities.

Remember, Obama and the rest of the civil rights groups were up in arm when the Patriots Act allowed Bush to intercept phone calls involving foreign nationals. Now, ALL U.S. citizens phone records, emails are all recorded and become property of the U.S. goverment. If you don't see anything wrong with that, then you're just a freaking idiot.

It's all Obama's fault!

hahaha

I'll put you down in the hypocrite column.

Seriously, I think it's good to be outraged by this but anybody who puts this on Obama is either partisan or ignorant of what has been going on forever. This isn't Obama's policy, it's been the government's policy since at least the start of the cold war. The big difference now is that we conduct so many communications electronically which makes it easier for the government to snoop.

If you think a president Romney would have put an end to this then you're just a freaking idiot.

[ashaman]

It's all Obama's fault!

hahaha I'll put you down in the hypocrite column.

LOL, while you're at it, maybe you can put Obama down in they hypocrite column too.

Q: Does the president have inherent powers under the Constitution to conduct surveillance for national security purposes without judicial warrants, regardless of federal statutes?
A: The Supreme Court has never held that the president has such powers. As president, I will follow existing law, and when it comes to U.S. citizens and residents, I will only authorize surveillance for national security purposes consistent with FISA and other federal statutes.

http://www.ontheissues.org/2012/Bara...d_Security.htm

But soon after the PATRIOT Act passed, a few years before I ever arrived in the Senate, I began hearing concerns from people of every background and political leaning that this law didn't just provide law enforcement the powers it needed to keep us safe, but powers it didn't need to invade our privacy without cause or suspicion.

http://obamaspeeches.com/053-Floor-S...ama-Speech.htm

Yeah, I love myself a double talker. There are many more Obama double talks if you want to look for them. I can make a totally separate post just on that!

[ashaman]

It's all Obama's fault!

hahaha

I'll put you down in the hypocrite column.

Seriously, I think it's good to be outraged by this but anybody who puts this on Obama is either partisan or ignorant of what has been going on forever. This isn't Obama's policy, it's been the government's policy since at least the start of the cold war. The big difference now is that we conduct so many communications electronically which makes it easier for the government to snoop.

If you think a president Romney would have put an end to this then you're just a freaking idiot.

You're missing the point there. Patriots Act is Bush's program. Used to spy on foreign nationals. Obama EXPANDED it to include all U.S. citizens! If you can't get that, then yu're just a freaking ignorant idiot.

[JuTMSY4]

wait?

You're missing the point there. Patriots Act is Bush's program. Used to spy on foreign nationals. Obama EXPANDED it to include all U.S. citizens! If you can't get that, then yu're just a freaking ignorant idiot.

You think the PATRIOT act only allowed the Gov't to spy only on foreign nationals?

[IronEagle]

You're missing the point there. Patriots Act is Bush's program. Used to spy on foreign nationals. Obama EXPANDED it to include all U.S. citizens! If you can't get that, then yu're just a freaking ignorant idiot.

So, you're confident that the NSA under Bush wasn't spying on U.S. citizens? Or that even prior to Bush the NSA wasn't eavesdropping on conversations involving US citizens?

The NSA has been around a long time.

[ashaman]

You think the PATRIOT act only allowed the Gov't to spy only on foreign nationals?

No, it allowed spying on U.S. citizens phone calls that INVOLVED foreign nationals. If a call has a foreign national on one side of the conversation, then that's what the Patriots Act allowed to spy on.

[JuTMSY4]

No, it allowed spying on U.S. citizens phone calls that INVOLVED foreign nationals. If a call has a foreign national on one side of the conversation, then that's what the Patriots Act allowed to spy on.

foreign nationals need not be involved. That's my understanding.

[ashaman]

foreign nationals need not be involved. That's my understanding.

And also, you needed a warrant or at least under suspicions to get spied on. Now, that's not even necessary. All your phone records, emails are handed over to the U.S. government regardless of suspicions or issued warrants.
That's a bad thing if you don't see it.