Congratulations NRA

[Irish George]

That is all

[TerpEagle]

That is all

My thoughts and prayers go out to the NRA as they navigate this troubled time of bad press and high profits.

[CbEagle]

and our thoughts and prayers to the GOP for their thoughts and prayers for the victims while taking Nra money and blocking all reform.

[McCarthy12]

I'm still waiting for someone to suggest a realistic solution to gun violence. Repeal the Second Amendment? That doesn't make guns illegal it just makes it easier to pass the laws necessary to do so. Make guns illegal? Then what? Go door to door and collect them all? That's Trumpesque and it won't stop criminals from getting them.

I'm all for universal background checks and any measure that will reduce gun violence. I completely agree with the op-ed that was in the New York Times today. But, in my estimation, gun violence is here to stay until generations of Americans are raised to actually value human life. It's the culture of America that is different than all these countries that are continually cited in statistics and fancy bar graphs. In the meantime, we can continue to play the blame game and drive whatever narrative suits our political agenda.

[Irish George]

That's all probably true but...

I'm still waiting for someone to suggest a realistic solution to gun violence. Repeal the Second Amendment? That doesn't make guns illegal it just makes it easier to pass the laws necessary to do so. Make guns illegal? Then what? Go door to door and collect them all? That's Trumpesque and it won't stop criminals from getting them.

I'm all for universal background checks and any measure that will reduce gun violence. I completely agree with the op-ed that was in the New York Times today. But, in my estimation, gun violence is here to stay until generations of Americans are raised to actually value human life. It's the culture of America that is different than all these countries that are continually cited in statistics and fancy bar graphs. In the meantime, we can continue to play the blame game and drive whatever narrative suits our political agenda.

If one guy unsuccessfully tried a shoe bomb and now each of us must take off our shoes at the airport, shouldn't there be a mechanism in place to discourage gun violence?

[CCPete]

It's all about the money. The gun lobby and the oil/coal lobby make politicians rich to get their no vote even on the most common sense of laws.

So, we go nowhere on guns and protecting the environment.

[McCarthy12]

There can be. There was a good op-ed in the NYT that had some nice suggestions. But there are 3 million guns already in circulation. Even if you outlawed the sale of guns starting today, it would probably reduce gun violence to some extent, but it wouldn't eliminate it to anyone's satisfaction. I'm just really pessimistic on this issue. I think you have the convergence of a history of guns being a cultural norm and a culture that has, over time, devalued the dignity of human beings. This is the result.

[McCarthy12]

Why don't you just predict the end of gun violence in America? Actually, please don't do that.

[PackWest]

But there are 3 million guns already in circulation. Even if you outlawed the sale of guns starting today, it would probably reduce gun violence to some extent, but it wouldn't eliminate it to anyone's satisfaction. I'm just really pessimistic on this issue.

Once upon a time, there was an old man who used to go to the ocean to do his writing. He had a habit of walking on the beach every morning before he began his work. Early one morning, he was walking along the shore after a big storm had passed and found the vast beach littered with starfish as far as the eye could see, stretching in both directions.

Off in the distance, the old man noticed a small boy approaching. As the boy walked, he paused every so often and as he grew closer, the man could see that he was occasionally bending down to pick up an object and throw it into the sea. The boy came closer still and the man called out, “Good morning! May I ask what it is that you are doing?”

The young boy paused, looked up, and replied “Throwing starfish into the ocean. The tide has washed them up onto the beach and they can’t return to the sea by themselves,” the youth replied. “When the sun gets high, they will die, unless I throw them back into the water.”

The old man replied, “But there must be tens of thousands of starfish on this beach. I’m afraid you won’t really be able to make much of a difference.”

The boy bent down, picked up yet another starfish and threw it as far as he could into the ocean.

Then he turned, smiled and said, “It made a difference to that one!”

[Irish George]

Don't disagree but we have to try

There can be. There was a good op-ed in the NYT that had some nice suggestions. But there are 3 million guns already in circulation. Even if you outlawed the sale of guns starting today, it would probably reduce gun violence to some extent, but it wouldn't eliminate it to anyone's satisfaction. I'm just really pessimistic on this issue. I think you have the convergence of a history of guns being a cultural norm and a culture that has, over time, devalued the dignity of human beings. This is the result.

Like I said...TSA makes us jump hoops before we get on a plane...and they should. If it saves just one life, gun regs would be worth it

[Irish George]

Exactly

Great post

[harls]

I'm still waiting for someone to suggest a realistic solution to gun violence. Repeal the Second Amendment? That doesn't make guns illegal it just makes it easier to pass the laws necessary to do so. Make guns illegal? Then what? Go door to door and collect them all? That's Trumpesque and it won't stop criminals from getting them.

I'm all for universal background checks and any measure that will reduce gun violence. I completely agree with the op-ed that was in the New York Times today. But, in my estimation, gun violence is here to stay until generations of Americans are raised to actually value human life. It's the culture of America that is different than all these countries that are continually cited in statistics and fancy bar graphs. In the meantime, we can continue to play the blame game and drive whatever narrative suits our political agenda.

My suggestion would be to first implement background checks on each and every gun transaction. Second create a registration of all guns if you are caught with a gun that is not registered you go to jail. If you are caught with a gun that is registered to someone else you both go to jail. If a gun is used to commit a crime that is registered to you then you are charged as an accessory to the crime. If you leave your gun lying around and your 5 year old picks it up and shoots your 3 year old you go to jail.

This will put enough people in jail that we can let out non violent offenders and people who are in jail for marijuana and still keep the prison industrial complex happy. It will discourage people from being careless with their guns because they will actually be held responsible.

Obviously if someone breaks into your house and steals your gun if you report it stolen you won't be held responsible for what happens with it.

[TerpEagle]

There can be. There was a good op-ed in the NYT that had some nice suggestions. But there are 3 million guns already in circulation. Even if you outlawed the sale of guns starting today, it would probably reduce gun violence to some extent, but it wouldn't eliminate it to anyone's satisfaction. I'm just really pessimistic on this issue. I think you have the convergence of a history of guns being a cultural norm and a culture that has, over time, devalued the dignity of human beings. This is the result.

I'm pessimistic too. It may be that we've surpassed a critical point in terms of available firearms, but the correlation between the number of guns in the country and the amount of gun violence is astounding.

So the best solution would probably be reducing the overall number of guns floating around either through buybacks or seizures but that won't realistically happen. Greatly reducing future production may help, but the gun lobby is deep into the pockets of at nominally half of the elected representatives in this country.

Organizations such as the NRA simply want to increase the number of guns in circulation because it benefits them both directly and indirectly. Directly because it makes it easier for people to buy their product and indirectly because more guns means more violence which means a certain segment of the population feeling the need to be even further armed to protect themselves against the violence. It's a very profitable cycle and unless the NRA/gun manufacturers lose power/influence and/or face actually repercussions for the violence it's going to continue.

Harls' suggestions I think are good ones. The big pro-gun argument is that good-guys with guns are needed to take out bad-guys with guns. Well, somehow the bad-guys are getting the guns and I don't think they're manufacturing them on their own. Penalties on the manufacturers, distributors and owners whose weapons end up in the wrong hands would hopefully curb the gun violence as well.

The real solution is a change in mindset - the idea that owning a gun provides a tangible amount of protection (personal or from government tyranny) is significantly flawed.

[McCarthy12]

Totally. A journey of 100 miles begins with a single step. I get it. However, I would argue that as a society we place about the same premium on human dignity as the old man does with the starfish.

[HEREisAKERS]

Technology.

You need to link the gun to the user. All guns manufactured prior to this technology being developed need to be turned in. If you want to own a pre-tech gun, you must endure a LENGTHY application process and be able to pay a lot. You're a collector or whatever. (Personally I think this is dumb but that's besides the point...oh I love my vintage hunting gun from Grandpappy Brown! -- fuckattahere.) The tech solution:

The gun constantly emits a signal that can be paired with a smartphone. Think RFID...You CAN NOT disable this and if you do, the local police are notified using cellular networks. The device MUST be paired to the phone. Otherwise, it can not fire. The hammer can not go down without this. The phone must be authenticated with your FINGERPRINT to be accessed and accept gun pairing. A companion app can see how many bullets are in the gun which you download from the precious NRA and ATF! Should one be expelled, the app reports this. Let's say you're going hunting. You can say OK! I'm going hunting -- here's where, and I have 200 rounds I intend to use...turn on hunting mode...

You need to use the technology to force accountability. You can't escape your fingerprint plus pairing plus licenses. The grip on the gun MATCHES YOUR FINGERPRINT to the one you ahthenticated on the smartphone!!!

I'm sorry but NOBODY is doing a real damn thing about this. Anyone who protests the integration of technology into firearms is a jerkoff. These are the people who are nefarious or so attached to their old pistol out of some jerked off nostalgic love affair that kids, innocent people are dying.

It's just got to happen. You use a gun without this? Prison. You have a gun without this? PRISON. You are pulled over and you have a gun and not the companion app? PRISON. For a long time. No parole. Sure, have your guns. But be accountable. Identify yourself and be visible. Be transparent. DO THE RIGHT THING.

Now you might say well why do I need to sacrifice my PRIVACY for your SECURITY. Well, because you are forcing me to sacrifice my SAFETY for your PRIVACY. And you do not get to choose that for me. In one scenario, people live and in the other, people die. Those on the side of life should not bear the burden of sacrifice.

Fix it!